Core Insights - Hyatt Hotels Corporation reported third-quarter 2025 results, with adjusted earnings and revenues missing the Zacks Consensus Estimate, while the top line grew year-over-year and the bottom line declined [1][4]. Financial Performance - Adjusted loss per share was 30 cents, missing the consensus estimate of 49 cents, compared to an adjusted earnings per share of 94 cents in the same quarter last year [4][10]. - Revenues reached $1.78 billion, missing the consensus mark of $1.83 billion, but increased by 9.6% year-over-year [4][10]. - Owned and Leased revenues were $429 million, up from $287 million in the prior-year quarter, while Distribution revenues declined by 13.1% year-over-year to $192 million [5]. Revenue Breakdown - Gross fees increased by 5.9% year-over-year to $283 million, with base management fees rising by 10%, incentive management fees up by 2%, and franchise and other fees advancing by 4% [6]. - Net fees for the quarter were $249 million, compared to $241 million in the prior-year quarter [7]. Operating Highlights - Adjusted EBITDA was $291 million, up 5.6% year-over-year, and increased by 10.1% after adjusting for assets sold in 2024 [8]. - Adjusted EBITDA in the Management and Franchising segment was $226 million, compared to $221 million in the prior-year quarter [9]. Balance Sheet - As of September 30, 2025, cash and cash equivalents were $749 million, down from $912 million in the previous quarter, with total liquidity at $2.2 billion [11]. - Total debt remained flat at $6 billion [11]. Business Updates - In Q3, 5,163 rooms were added to Hyatt's system, with a pipeline of approximately 141,000 rooms, reflecting a 4.4% year-over-year increase [12]. - The company anticipates net rooms growth of 6.3% to 7% year-over-year, excluding Playa [13]. 2025 Outlook - Expected adjusted general and administrative expenses for 2025 are between $446 million and $452 million, with capital expenditures anticipated at about $225 million [13]. - System-wide RevPAR is projected to rise by 2-2.5% from the 2024 level, with adjusted EBITDA expected to be in the range of $1.09-$1.11 billion [14].

Welcome back. Shares of high and heading higher this morning on the heels of Q3 results. Company also announced an expanded partnership with Chase saying its ongoing PIA transaction is expected to close prior to the end of the year.Joining us in an exclusive interview this morning is the CEO of Hyatt, Mark Complasian. Mark, it's great to have you back. Good morning.>> Thanks, Carl. It's great to be with you. >> We've been watching these RevPAR trends pretty closely.Obviously keeping one eye on the shutdown, ...

Core Insights - The company has reported strong Q3 results, leading to a positive market reaction with shares rising [1] - An expanded partnership with Chase is expected to significantly enhance earnings, with projections indicating an increase from approximately $50 million to over $100 million annually over the next two years [8] Group Business Outlook - October bookings for group business are up 15% year-over-year, indicating robust demand [4] - The outlook for group business in 2026 is strong, with luxury leisure being the strongest segment [5] Consumer Trends - The company has a high-end customer base, with luxury and lifestyle segments making up 40% of the total portfolio [7] - The loyalty program has been growing at a compounded rate of 30% since 2017, reflecting strong customer engagement [7] Financial Transactions - The company has executed over $8 billion in property transactions over the last seven years, indicating a strong track record in asset management [10] - The ongoing PIA transaction is expected to close by the end of the year, with no concerns regarding antitrust approval [12]

Financial Data and Key Metrics Changes - Same property hotel EBITDA totaled $105.4 million, in line with the midpoint of guidance, while adjusted EBITDA came in at $99.2 million, exceeding the midpoint by $2.2 million [3] - Adjusted FFO per share was $0.01, $0.03 above the midpoint, reflecting resilience in the operating model and disciplined cost management [3] - Same property occupancy increased nearly 190 basis points, while ADR declined 5.4%, resulting in a 3.1% decline in RevPAR and a 1.5% drop in same property total RevPAR [3][4] Business Line Data and Key Metrics Changes - Performance was led by properties in San Francisco and Chicago, with San Francisco's RevPAR rising 8.3% due to a 690 basis point jump in occupancy [4][5] - The resort portfolio remained resilient, with total RevPAR increasing by 0.7%, driven by Newport Harbor Island Resort's RevPAR jumping 29% [6] - Urban total RevPAR declined 2.7%, with strength in San Francisco and Chicago offset by weakness in Los Angeles and Washington, D.C. [7] Market Data and Key Metrics Changes - Washington, D.C. was the softest market, with RevPAR down 16.4% due to reduced government travel demand [7] - Los Angeles experienced a 10.4% decline in RevPAR, driven by adverse weather conditions [8] - Boston and San Diego also saw year-over-year declines attributed to lighter convention calendars and softer group attendance [8] Company Strategy and Development Direction - The company is focused on driving operating efficiencies and disciplined cost management, with a strategic redevelopment program enhancing market share and profitability [6][17] - The company plans to leverage favorable macroeconomic conditions and a robust events calendar in 2026 to drive growth [30] - The company is investing in AI-enabled tools to improve operational efficiency and reduce costs [17][42] Management's Comments on Operating Environment and Future Outlook - Management expressed cautious optimism for Q4 due to macroeconomic uncertainty and the ongoing government shutdown impacting travel [18][20] - The company anticipates a favorable setup for 2026, with expectations of normalized hotel demand correlating with GDP growth [22][23] - Management highlighted the potential for significant demand growth driven by major events and a favorable holiday calendar in 2026 [27][28] Other Important Information - The company entered into an agreement to sell one of its hotels for $72 million, expected to close in Q4 [11] - The company successfully completed a $400 million offering of convertible notes, using proceeds to retire existing debt [12] - The company expects to generate over $100 million in free cash flow by the end of 2026 [12] Q&A Session Summary Question: Inquiry about San Francisco lodging performance - Management noted that San Francisco is experiencing strong demand, allowing for increased room rates during high-occupancy nights [31][34] Question: Impact of AI industry on demand - Management observed a growing number of companies booking transient and group business, particularly in the AI sector, positively impacting weekday demand [37][38] Question: Expense management and labor costs - Management confirmed that efficiency improvements and reduced headcount are contributing to lower costs, with expectations for moderated labor costs in 2026 [39][40] Question: Future performance of Los Angeles market - Management expects Los Angeles to perform better in 2026 due to easier comps and a recovery in entertainment production [42] Question: Transaction market outlook - Management indicated a pause in the transaction market due to macro uncertainty but anticipates pent-up demand for transactions once clarity returns [44][46] Question: Attrition trends in bookings - Management noted increased attrition primarily in government-related bookings, but overall attrition payments were lower year-over-year [56][57]

Financial Data and Key Metrics Changes - System-wide RevPAR growth was reported at 0.3% for the quarter, impacted by a holiday shift and lapping one-time events from the previous year [8][18] - Adjusted EBITDA for the third quarter was $291 million, in line with expectations, with owned and leased segment adjusted EBITDA increasing by 7% when adjusted for asset sales [20][21] - Total liquidity as of September 30, 2025, was approximately $2.2 billion, including $1.5 billion in capacity on a revolving credit facility [22] Business Line Data and Key Metrics Changes - Leisure transient RevPAR increased by 1.6% year-over-year, with luxury brands seeing an approximate 6% increase [8] - Business transient RevPAR was flat, but improved performance in the U.S. showed a 3% growth compared to last year [9] - Group RevPAR declined by 4.9%, in line with expectations due to difficult year-over-year comparisons [9] Market Data and Key Metrics Changes - RevPAR outside of the U.S. performed well, with Europe seeing positive growth driven by strong international inbound travel [18] - Greater China experienced RevPAR growth due to increases in leisure transient demand [19] - All-inclusive portfolio net package RevPAR grew by 7.6% compared to the third quarter of 2024, indicating strong demand for leisure travel [19] Company Strategy and Development Direction - The company aims to exceed a 90% asset-led earnings mix in the near term and has a strong development pipeline of approximately 141,000 rooms [11][12] - The introduction of new brands, such as Hyatt Select and Unscripted, is expected to drive organic growth and enhance the development pipeline [11][12] - The loyalty program, World of Hyatt, surpassed 61 million members, reflecting a 20% year-over-year increase, and is positioned as a strategic asset for driving customer engagement [13][14] Management's Comments on Operating Environment and Future Outlook - Management expressed optimism about forward-looking booking trends, particularly for group bookings in the U.S. and internationally [10][35] - The company anticipates average rates to increase in the low to mid-single digit range in 2026 compared to 2025 [10] - Management highlighted strong leisure demand, with October showing a 3% increase in the U.S. and 7% globally [77] Other Important Information - The company expects to incur approximately $50 million in restructuring charges this year, primarily recorded in the third quarter [17] - Adjusted G&A costs are expected to be moderately below full-year 2024 levels despite inflation and additional costs from acquisitions [17] - The company plans to return approximately $350 million to shareholders in 2025, inclusive of share repurchases and dividends [26] Q&A Session Summary Question: Insights on net rooms growth for 2026 - Management indicated strong organic growth momentum, expecting 6%-7% growth in net rooms for 2026 based on current trends [29][30] Question: Group pace expectations for 2026 - Management reported high single-digit growth in group pace for 2026, with strong bookings in October [34][36] Question: Clarification on G&A expectations - Management confirmed expectations for adjusted G&A in 2026 to be slightly down compared to 2024, driven by organizational efficiencies [39][40] Question: Capital returns and restructuring charges - Management explained that the increase in capital returns is linked to the new credit card agreement and restructuring charges factored into free cash flow [42][44] Question: Economic intensity of the Home Inns agreement - Management highlighted the successful partnership with Home Inns, focusing on quality and strategic growth in the Chinese market [50][51] Question: Cost initiatives and organizational changes - Management discussed the shift towards an insight-led and brand-focused organization, emphasizing efficiency and agility in operations [57][60] Question: RevPAR outlook for 2026 - Management expressed confidence in RevPAR growth driven by upcoming events and strong leisure demand, expecting positive results both in the U.S. and internationally [75][76]

Financial Data and Key Metrics Changes - System-wide RevPAR growth was reported at 0.3% for the quarter, impacted by a holiday shift and lapping one-time events from the previous year [8][18] - Adjusted EBITDA for the third quarter was $291 million, in line with expectations, with owned and leased segment adjusted EBITDA increasing by 7% when adjusted for asset sales [20][21] - Total liquidity as of September 30, 2025, was approximately $2.2 billion, including $1.5 billion in capacity on a revolving credit facility [22] Business Line Data and Key Metrics Changes - Leisure transient RevPAR increased by 1.6% year-over-year, with luxury brands seeing approximately 6% growth [8] - Business transient RevPAR was flat, but improved performance in the U.S. grew by 3% compared to last year [9] - Group RevPAR declined by 4.9%, in line with expectations due to difficult year-over-year comparisons [9] Market Data and Key Metrics Changes - RevPAR outside the U.S. performed well, with Europe seeing positive growth driven by strong international inbound travel [18] - Greater China experienced RevPAR growth due to increases in leisure transient demand [19] - The all-inclusive portfolio reported net package RevPAR growth of 7.6%, reflecting strong demand for leisure travel [19] Company Strategy and Development Direction - The company aims to exceed a 90% asset-led earnings mix in the near term and has a strong development pipeline of approximately 141,000 rooms [11][12] - The introduction of new brands, Hyatt Select and Unscripted, is expected to drive organic growth and momentum in signings [10][11] - The loyalty program, World of Hyatt, surpassed 61 million members, reflecting a 20% year-over-year increase, enhancing customer engagement and brand loyalty [13][14] Management's Comments on Operating Environment and Future Outlook - Management expressed optimism about forward-looking booking trends, with group pace for full-service U.S. hotels up in the high single digits [10][34] - The company expects average rates to increase in the low to mid-single digit range in 2026 compared to 2025 [10] - Management remains confident in the strength of leisure demand, with October showing a 3% increase in the U.S. and 7% globally [76] Other Important Information - The company plans to return approximately $350 million to shareholders in 2025, inclusive of share repurchases and dividends [25][62] - Adjusted G&A costs are expected to be moderately below full year 2024 levels, despite inflation and additional costs from acquisitions [17][38] Q&A Session Summary Question: Insights on net rooms growth and pipeline for 2026 - Management indicated strong organic growth momentum, expecting 6%-7% growth in net rooms for 2026, with 38 hotels planned to open in Q4 [29][30] Question: Group pace in the U.S. and internationally for 2026 - Group pace was reported up in the high single digits, with strong bookings in October, indicating confidence in future group business [34][35] Question: Clarification on G&A expectations for 2026 - Management confirmed expectations for adjusted G&A to be slightly down in 2026 due to organizational changes and efficiencies [38][39] Question: Capital returns and free cash flow - The increase in capital returns was attributed to the new credit card agreement and restructuring charges, with a goal of closer to 100% of free cash flow returned to shareholders in 2026 [41][43] Question: Economic intensity of the master agreement with Homeinns - Management highlighted the successful partnership with Homeinns, focusing on quality and strategic growth in the Chinese market [49][50] Question: Insights on cost initiatives and organizational changes - The company is moving towards an insight-led and brand-focused organization, emphasizing efficiency and agility in operations [56][58] Question: RevPAR outlook for 2026 - Management expressed confidence in RevPAR growth due to upcoming events like the World Cup and strong leisure demand, expecting positive results both in the U.S. and internationally [72][75]

Financial Data and Key Metrics Changes - Normalized FFO for Q3 2025 was $33,900,000 or $0.20 per share, down from $0.32 per share in the prior year quarter [19] - Adjusted EBITDAre decreased by $10,000,000 year over year to $145,000,000, primarily impacted by a $13,100,000 decline in adjusted hotel EBITDA and an $8,700,000 increase in interest expense [19][20] - Overall financial results were affected by a decline in gross operating profit margin percentage to 24.4%, down 330 basis points from the prior year [19] Business Line Data and Key Metrics Changes - Hotel portfolio generated adjusted hotel EBITDA of $44,300,000, an 18.9% decline from the prior year due to softer demand and expense pressures [20] - RevPAR for the retained hotel portfolio increased by 60 basis points year over year to $114, while the overall hotel portfolio's RevPAR increased by 20 basis points year over year [10][20] - The triple net lease segment reported rent growth over 2%, stable rent coverage, and occupancy over 97% [13] Market Data and Key Metrics Changes - Domestic leisure travel has declined to its lowest point in several years, reflecting heightened price sensitivity and a shift towards shorter booking windows [9] - The U.S. travel market continues to face headwinds with uneven demand trends amid persistent economic uncertainty [9] Company Strategy and Development Direction - The company is focused on capital recycling initiatives, including the sale of 121 hotels for gross proceeds of $959,000,000, with 69 hotel sales expected to close in November and December [7][8] - The strategic shift towards a net lease company is intended to improve portfolio fundamentals and provide optionality with financing sources [8][15] - Significant capital investments have been made to elevate the quality and performance of hotels, with renovations completed at approximately 45% of the retained hotel portfolio [12] Management's Comments on Operating Environment and Future Outlook - Management noted that the current operating environment is characterized by economic uncertainty and a cautious consumer mindset [9] - The company expects the disposition pipeline to normalize, supporting stability and margin improvement as it moves into 2026 [11] - Future guidance for Q4 includes projected RevPAR of $86 to $89 and adjusted hotel EBITDA in the range of $20,000,000 to $25,000,000, considering seasonality and recent headwinds [21] Other Important Information - The company raised over $850,000,000 in proceeds, including $295,000,000 from asset sales during the quarter and approximately $490,000,000 from the issuance of new zero coupon bonds [7][8] - The company has a current debt outstanding of $5,500,000,000 with a weighted average interest rate of 5.9% [22] Q&A Session Summary Question: How realistic is it that all remaining hotel sales will close by year-end? - Management indicated that they are tracking to close 40% to 50% of the remaining balance in November, with the rest in December [27][28] Question: Can you discuss the $27,000,000 impairment taken in the quarter? - Management explained that it was related to shifting purchase price allocations among portfolios and does not indicate further impairments [30] Question: What is the outlook for price coverage in the travel center portfolio? - Management noted that while there has been a decline in coverage, it is stabilizing and not a major concern due to backing from BP [32][34] Question: How did hotel EBITDA perform versus expectations? - Management stated that timing of asset sales was the biggest driver of performance, with several one-time impacts affecting results [38][40] Question: What is the rationale behind issuing zero coupon bonds? - The primary goal was to provide headroom with covenants and improve liquidity, allowing for better management of debt maturities [49][51] Question: Will there be further hotel dispositions in 2026? - Management confirmed plans for continued dispositions in 2026, focusing on hotels with negative EBITDA [58]

Portfolio Repositioning - Pebblebrook has strategically shifted its portfolio towards leisure-oriented and group-focused properties, reducing exposure to urban and corporate transient markets since 2019[15] - Resort EBITDA contribution increased from 17% to 47%, while Urban EBITDA contribution decreased from 83% to 53%[19] - The company acquired 5 upper upscale and luxury resorts for $802 million and sold 15 lower-quality urban properties for $12 billion[19] - East Coast properties now contribute 56% of EBITDA, up from 38%, while San Francisco's EBITDA contribution declined by 18%, and West Coast properties now contribute 40% of EBITDA, down from 56%[19] Financial Performance and Growth Opportunities - The company estimates a Hotel EBITDA upside of approximately $71 million, with $16 million from urban markets recovery, $45 million from ROI redevelopment projects, and $10 million from LaPlaya EBITDA growth opportunity[11, 23] - The company anticipates a potential $45+ million increase in its Urban Hotel EBITDA over the next three to four years, supported by a favorable long-term outlook[35] - Approximately $278 million of ROI capital invested is estimated to generate annual stabilized EBITDA gains of $29 to $33 million[11, 44] - LaPlaya Beach Resort & Club generated $19 million of hotel EBITDA in 2024 and is forecasting $25 million for 2025[51] Valuation and Financing - Pebblebrook's recent public market valuation reflects an approximate 55% discount to its recently calculated private market valuation of $2350 per share[11, 54, 57] - The company completed a $400 million private offering of 2030 1625% Convertible Notes, using proceeds to retire an equal amount of its 2026 175% Convertible Notes at a 2% discount to par[61, 62] - Approximately 43 million common shares were repurchased at $1156/share, increasing the effective all-in equity conversion price to $2443/share[62, 64]

Financial Data and Key Metrics Changes - Normalized FFO for Q3 2025 was $33.9 million or $0.20 per share, down from $0.32 per share in the prior year quarter [15] - Adjusted EBITDA RE decreased by $10 million year over year to $145 million, primarily impacted by a $13.1 million decline in adjusted hotel EBITDA and an $8.7 million increase in interest expense [15][16] - Gross operating profit margin percentage declined by 330 basis points to 24.4% [15] Business Line Data and Key Metrics Changes - Hotel portfolio generated adjusted hotel EBITDA of $44.3 million, an 18.9% decline from the prior year due to softer demand and expense pressures [16] - REVPAR for the retained portfolio increased by 60 basis points year over year to $114, while the 76 domestic exit hotels not yet sold generated REVPAR of $72, a decline of 1% [16][17] - The triple net lease segment reported annualized base rent growth of 2.3% and NOI increased by 50 basis points year over year [12] Market Data and Key Metrics Changes - The U.S. travel market is facing headwinds, with domestic leisure travel declining to its lowest point in several years, reflecting heightened price sensitivity and shorter booking windows [7] - The triple net lease market continues to show resilience and growth, driven by consumer preferences for convenience and affordability [10] Company Strategy and Development Direction - The company is focused on capital recycling initiatives, strengthening its balance sheet, and transitioning towards a net lease company [5][6] - Significant capital investments have been made to elevate hotel quality, with renovations completed at nearly 45% of the retained hotel portfolio [9] - The company plans to continue with hotel dispositions in 2026, focusing on negative EBITDA hotels [48] Management's Comments on Operating Environment and Future Outlook - Management noted that the travel industry is experiencing softness, with cost pressures and a cautious consumer mindset impacting performance [7][36] - The company expects to see stability and margin improvement as the disposition pipeline normalizes and renovated hotels capture additional market share [9][20] - Fourth-quarter guidance projects REVPAR of $86-$89 and adjusted hotel EBITDA in the $20-$25 million range, considering seasonality and recent headwinds [17] Other Important Information - The company raised over $850 million in proceeds, including $295 million from asset sales during the quarter [5] - The company has $5.5 billion of debt outstanding with a weighted average interest rate of 5.9% [18] - Full-year CapEx guidance has been lowered from $250 million to approximately $200 million due to a shift in the pace of deployment [20] Q&A Session Summary Question: How realistic is it that all remaining hotel sales will close by year-end? - Management indicated that they are tracking to close 40-50% of the remaining balance in November, with the rest in December [23] Question: Can you discuss the $27 million impairment taken in the quarter? - Management clarified that it was related to shifting purchase price allocations and does not indicate further impairments [25] Question: What is the expectation for the declining rent coverage in the travel center portfolio? - Management noted that while there has been a decline, they are not particularly concerned due to the investment-grade backing from BP [27] Question: Can you elaborate on the hotel portfolio's Q3 performance? - Management explained that the timing of asset sales and some insurable events contributed to the performance being below expectations [32] Question: What is the rationale behind issuing zero-coupon bonds? - The primary goal was to provide headroom with covenants and improve liquidity, allowing for better management of debt maturities [40] Question: What is the outlook for potential further dispositions in 2026? - Management confirmed plans to continue with hotel dispositions in 2026, focusing on negative EBITDA hotels [48]

Financial Data and Key Metrics Changes - System-wide RevPAR growth was reported at 0.3% for the quarter, impacted by a holiday shift and lapping one-time events from the previous year [6][18] - Adjusted EBITDA for the third quarter was $291 million, in line with expectations, with owned and leased segment adjusted EBITDA increasing by 7% when adjusted for asset sales [20][25] - Total liquidity as of September 30, 2025, was approximately $2.2 billion, including $1.5 billion in capacity on a revolving credit facility [21] Business Line Data and Key Metrics Changes - Leisure transient RevPAR increased by 1.6% year-over-year, with luxury brands seeing approximately 6% growth [6][7] - Business transient RevPAR was flat for the quarter, but improved by 3% in the United States [8][19] - Group RevPAR declined by 4.9%, in line with expectations due to difficult year-over-year comparisons [8][19] Market Data and Key Metrics Changes - RevPAR outside of the U.S. performed well, with Europe seeing positive growth driven by strong international inbound travel [18] - Greater China experienced RevPAR growth due to increases in leisure transient demand [19] - The all-inclusive portfolio reported net package RevPAR growth of 7.6% compared to the third quarter of 2024 [7][19] Company Strategy and Development Direction - The company aims to exceed a 90% asset-led earnings mix in the near term and has a strong development pipeline of approximately 141,000 rooms [10][11] - The introduction of new brands, such as Hyatt Select and Unscripted, is expected to drive growth and enhance the company's market presence [10][11] - The loyalty program, World of Hyatt, surpassed 61 million members, reflecting a 20% year-over-year increase, and is positioned as a key strategic asset [12][15] Management's Comments on Operating Environment and Future Outlook - Management expressed optimism about forward-looking booking trends, particularly for group business, which is up in the high single digits for full-service U.S. hotels [9][35] - The company anticipates average rates to increase in the low to mid-single digit range in 2026 compared to 2025 [9] - Management noted that leisure demand remains strong, with October RevPAR increasing by approximately 1% in the U.S. and 5% globally [24][75] Other Important Information - The company expects to incur approximately $50 million in restructuring charges this year, primarily recorded in the third quarter [17] - The full-year adjusted EBITDA outlook is expected to be in the range of $1.09-$1.11 billion, reflecting an 8% increase at the midpoint compared to last year [25] - The company plans to return approximately $350 million to shareholders in 2025, inclusive of share repurchases and dividends [26] Q&A Session Summary Question: Insights on net rooms growth for 2026 - Management indicated strong organic growth, expecting continued acceleration in signings and a net rooms growth of 6%-7% for 2026 [29][31] Question: Group pace in the U.S. and internationally for 2026 - Group pace was reported to be up in the high single digits, with strong bookings in October, indicating confidence in future group business [35][36] Question: Clarification on G&A expectations - Management expects adjusted G&A in 2026 to be moderately below 2024 levels due to organizational changes and efficiencies [39][40] Question: Capital returns and restructuring charges - The increase in capital returns is attributed to the new agreement with Chase and the restructuring charges factored into free cash flow [42][43] Question: Economic intensity of the master agreement with Home Inns - The partnership with Home Inns is expected to provide significant growth opportunities, with a focus on quality and strategic locations [48][49] Question: Cost program initiatives - The company is moving towards an insight-led and brand-focused organization, aiming for greater efficiency and improved performance [54][56] Question: Confidence in the RevPAR environment for next year - Management expressed optimism about RevPAR growth due to upcoming events like the World Cup and strong leisure demand [71][75] Question: Current sentiment regarding China - Management feels incrementally better about the Chinese market, noting strong performance in luxury brands despite some challenges [77][82]